Mixing Drums for breaks

Seek advice, post tracks, help others, discuss studio hardware and software - from studio pros to beginners, all are welcome...

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nectarios
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Post by nectarios » Wed Nov 16, 2005 3:16 pm

Ah, I remember I had a link for Vigi when he was trying SX out (he still uses Logic ;) ) for side chain compression.

http://www.mantikonline.com/art_sc.htm
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Walter Odington
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Post by Walter Odington » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:05 pm

hmm, nice link
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Post by alex_virr » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:23 pm

that link is proper - me gon go home and do it now. psweet!
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Post by shapshankly » Wed Nov 16, 2005 5:30 pm

nice link nec, cheers mate
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Post by stoefln » Wed Nov 16, 2005 5:47 pm

nicest link ive ever seen! :roll:
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Post by TT_ » Wed Nov 16, 2005 6:13 pm

Sidechain compression is a powerful technique

I think its better to learn how to mix without it before you delve into the his and los of dealing with a complex sidechained mixdown.

The basic point of it is to make the drums stand out more by turning down other elements in the mix when the drums hit in

You dont hav to use it on drums tho.

Before you get into that isuggest that you learn about EQ, compression and reverb PROPERLY

compression is a wierd thing. Theres no rules really and even tho in my head i understand it im not sure i could explain it properly.

Essentially a compressor is for reducing dynamic range. Sure we've all heard that before. But what USE is it when im making breaks????

Well you need to differentiate between transparent and colourful compression. A lot of digital compression is "transparent" ie it squashes the dynamics but leaves the tone of the sound similiar to when you started. This is what you want to use to manage your mixdown.

However some compressors dramatically colour the sound making it sound FAT and warm or even crunchy. This is the type of compression you want to use to beef up your sounds. There are not many digital comressors that really do this well. The Waves rennaisance comp is ok, The UAD Fairchild is good. The daddy has to be the UAD 1176N.

The truth is that for colouring your sounds an analog hardware compressor is often the best thing. (valves dont hurt either)

Only use compression on bass and drum sounds? no no no. This is missing the point entirely. A compressor only damages the dynamic range of a sound if you set it up wrong. Using the attack and release carefully will ensure that the sound still has PUNCH

When im working I will compress most things.

Also if you find that compression always sounds shit for you then try fiddling with the attack setting. You cant expect a compression preset to work 1st time. It might , it might not.

You have to use a hardware unit like say a reall urei 1176 to kno the difference. I had one of these babies for a while and im sorry but even the UAD version dont really stand up to it.

Ok im gonna let you all in on a closely guarded secret. Top producers (im not naming names) often have two sets of the same drums, one compressed to buggery (using some bling compression) and the other left dry. Combining them together gives you a seriously FAT sound.

Jesus maybe i SHOULD write a book.

I just like to pass on knowledge for the benefit of others and for the good of the mothership breakbeat!!!!
like I sad, it doesn't need any of y'alls feedback
SG i got no problem with my argumentative friend. But that just seems like a silly thing to say. I mean for example there are a lot of top producers, engineers etc who browse this forum. (the plumps, christian J, Meat katie, Vigi , elite Force the list goes on and on)

Are you telling me your records are better than theirs??????

Are you saying that your drums are fatter than the plumps and or chris J????

(im afraid the only way that this can be tru is if you sampled their drums and put em in yer own track. sorry but its tru)

It is my opinion that you can learn something important from anyone no matter who they are or what they do.
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Post by alex_virr » Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:19 am

I think I may have learnt something here :D

:lurve:
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Post by dopamine » Thu Nov 17, 2005 7:02 am

tamprecision wrote: Ok im gonna let you all in on a closely guarded secret. Top producers (im not naming names) often have two sets of the same drums, one compressed to buggery (using some bling compression) and the other left dry. Combining them together gives you a seriously FAT sound.
I heard about this a few years ago from a mate doing dnb. He suggested compressing and highpassing one track and leaving the clone dry. Do the compressor and filter alter the tone enough to ensure no phasing occurs? I've never actually tried the technique.
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Post by dopamine » Thu Nov 17, 2005 7:05 am

nec wrote:Ah, I remember I had a link for Vigi when he was trying SX out (he still uses Logic ;) ) for side chain compression.

http://www.mantikonline.com/art_sc.htm
Holy shit, what a fiasco to get sidechaining going with that compressor! :lol:

Just use TC native Bundle 3.0 compressor + sidechain plugin and be done with it. No messing around.
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Post by stoefln » Thu Nov 17, 2005 8:13 am

Ok im gonna let you all in on a closely guarded secret. Top producers (im not naming names) often have two sets of the same drums, one compressed to buggery (using some bling compression) and the other left dry. Combining them together gives you a seriously FAT sound.
Just tried this one in ableton live!
Looks like i get a lot of phasing on the snare with this tec- anyone has an idea?
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Post by SubtleGestures » Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:10 am

I know jack shit about compression.

interesting that the digital comps and analogue comps sound so different - I wouldn't know, because I really try to stay away from comp at all costs.




Tamp - You haven't been on here long, I talk out of my ass a lot, and this thread was no different.
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Post by alex_virr » Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:25 am

SubtleGestures wrote:I know jack shit about compression.
I wouldn't know, because I really try to stay away from comp at all costs.
how weird! from the moment I found out what compression did I've been working out how to use it to make my tracks silky smooth and bouncin like they do down the discotheque.
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Post by SubtleGestures » Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:29 am

The only time I use it is when I'm limiting my entire mix with my master toy.


other than that - never use it.... well, ONCE in a blue moon on vocals that are all over the place... seldom then even, cuz I like wild dynamics that add depth and texture.



think a couple times I used some presets on a comp er two for efx - ended up getting some gating type stuff out of it.



comp scares me for the most part
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Post by alex_virr » Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:35 am

if compression scares you - you should use something like psp vintage warmer and just put it on your drum track. it'll phatten it up loads without being really fiddley in the controls - it has great presets.
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Post by SubtleGestures » Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:54 am

I appreciate the tip.



Really, I just make sure my drums are sounding fat before I run my entire song through my mastering toy using limiting, and notching out 20 HZ and below.


After that, my songs come out sounding like anything I've got on vinyl... super loud, solid, and full.


With the right mastering tool - there is no need to use comp on seperate tracks in the song (imo anyway), because if you get all of your elements cracking initially, then run everything through a quality limiter at the end - you should end up with a result that is = to anything pro out there.


each to their own though - I totally hear where you're coming from, I just don't work that way iz all
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Post by El Huracan » Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:21 pm

SubtleGestures wrote:I know jack shit about anything
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Post by Joebot » Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:24 pm

tee hee

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Post by 7 below » Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:26 pm

steelz wrote:
SubtleGestures wrote:I know jack shit about anything
Normally I wouldn't condone such rude behaviour......

















but seeing as he's such a kernigget go on then!

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Post by -retired- » Sat Dec 10, 2005 1:19 pm

nec wrote:Ah, I remember I had a link for Vigi when he was trying SX out (he still uses Logic ;) ) for side chain compression.

http://www.mantikonline.com/art_sc.htm
No i don't . . . . .

I use the voxengo crunchessor for sidechaining in sx.

Ok . . for all you guys who want to sidechain in SX, here it is.

You set up a 'Quadro' Group channel.
This is a 4 input quadraphonic channel.

You get a compressor that can handle quadrophonic input and insert it on the 'Quadro' group channel.

You then send your b-line or whatever to the front of the quadro group channel (input 1+2) and your key input such as kick and snare to the back of the 'Quadro' Group (input 3+4).

You then set the compressor up so that only the front inputs 1+2are outputted and the back inputs simply trigger the compression.

Set your ratios/thresholds etc and off you go.

Sidechain is standard in SX3.
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Post by -retired- » Sat Dec 10, 2005 1:28 pm

nec wrote:Ah, I remember I had a link for Vigi when he was trying SX out (he still uses Logic ;) ) for side chain compression.

http://www.mantikonline.com/art_sc.htm
This link is only good for mono.
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